tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4446682073857250843.post2219183406533226744..comments2024-03-27T23:42:36.619-05:00Comments on Mock Ramblings: Friendly Evangelism: Whom Are You Talking To?Michael Mockhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06233321050691782148noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4446682073857250843.post-30127794883425786212011-03-17T08:36:57.266-05:002011-03-17T08:36:57.266-05:00Michael, also I want to add one more thing, and th...Michael, also I want to add one more thing, and then really want to hear more of what you have to share.<br /><br />I know you've said that all these ex- Christians already know..And, I'm sure that's true for many, but I don't know that it's true for all.<br /><br />When people share that they are now better people, more loving, and less judgmental since they have left the Christian faith, I have a hard time wrapping my mind around this. I think to myself, "Are we actually speaking of the same faith, the same Lord, here?"<br /><br />How can people know Jesus Christ, and not be increasing in their love for their neighbor, their care for the earth, their desire to promote peace, etc., at the sametime? How can they not overtime be becoming more open, and less judgmental, when Jesus says "Judge not that you be not judged.." I mean I could go on,and on here.<br /><br />From where I sit, I think something in their previous belief system had gone seriously spiritually haywire if they now are more accepting and loving after leaving the faith, than before.<br /><br /> I'm not going to judge that these dear people were not sincere, or "true Christians." Only God can know these kind of things, and I don't think it's for me to say at all. We're not all starting from the same place, afterall.<br /><br />But, I'm far from humanly convinced that Yes, they all really knew Him, understood in a deep, experiental way the Christian faith, but then simply chose otherwise, and walked away, and are now better more humane people, rejoicing in unbelief.<br /><br />Do you see what I mean, or do you feel my perceptions are faulty, and off base? It all doesn't add up from where I sit, and from my own experience. I wasn't always a Christian believer, Michael.<br /><br />Becky.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4446682073857250843.post-30265187300877105232011-03-16T10:36:13.171-05:002011-03-16T10:36:13.171-05:00Short answer: yes and no. Unfortunately, I don'...Short answer: yes and no. Unfortunately, I don't have time to compose a long answer right now - so please consider this an IOU, because I'd very much like to come back to it when I have time to do it right.Michael Mockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06233321050691782148noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4446682073857250843.post-13511566120075760662011-03-16T10:03:38.602-05:002011-03-16T10:03:38.602-05:00Thanks for this, Michael. I appreciate your though...Thanks for this, Michael. I appreciate your thoughts very much.<br /><br />You are very different than most people that I've come across on the various deconversion blogs. <br /><br />I think, Michael, that you have not had extremely hurtful, and wounding experiences in the church. You don't feel abandoned by God, or by Christians. Your unbelief truly is more rooted in intellectual reasoning, and questioning alone. I notice that you don't become easily angered, and offended at our discussions. <br /><br />But, it does feel to me that most people who share on the deconversion blogs have been deeply hurt, and disillusioned by their experience in the church, and they've found this identity and support together in "unbelief." Even if Christianity seemed true to them, they don't really want to be identified with "Christians" or with the church. Life actually seems better to them as unbelievers.<br /><br />And, yet at the same time, spiritual concerns are very much on their hearts, else they would not bother really discussing these issues in depth at all. In truth, Michael, on Bruce's blog alone, he raises deeper issues for discussion than many people are thinking about God who attend the Episcopal church every Sunday..:)<br /><br />Do you think I"m right in my sense of this? I'm open to hear your opinion, and will not be at all offended if you disagree.<br /><br />Becky.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4446682073857250843.post-9052301129943316322011-03-16T08:52:29.387-05:002011-03-16T08:52:29.387-05:00::chuckles:: I imagine that the apology was was fa...::chuckles:: I imagine that the apology was was far more unusual (hence, memorable) than the plan of salvation.<br /><br />To her credit, I think Grace is motivated, as much as anything, by the sense that Christianity {isn't / shouldn't be / doesn't have to be} as {controlling / restrictive / manipulative / damaging} as so many people have found it. And I understand that. I get the urge to explain that myself, and I'm not even a Christian.<br /><br />On the other hand, for a great many people, that very much *is* how Christianity is. And by the time you've left Christianity, you've left those beliefs entirely - so knowing that there are other, kinder versions of Christianity out there makes no difference.Michael Mockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06233321050691782148noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4446682073857250843.post-76208556361623837252011-03-16T05:50:58.783-05:002011-03-16T05:50:58.783-05:00Several years ago, maybe eight or nine, I was doin...Several years ago, maybe eight or nine, I was doing some Christian research for a class I was facilitating. I came across the Atlanta Free-Thought Society and made contact with the leader of the organization via email. I thought I could share the plan of salvation and reasons to believe. All of which were completely against every bit of the advice you've given here.<br /><br />In the end he was very polite, explaining to me that his father had been a preacher and that I hadn't said anything to him he hadn't already heard. I told him I'd pray for him, which I did. He told me he'd think of me a few times and then forget all about me, which I'm certain he did. <br /><br />At the time, as a staunch Christian, I still didn't get what he was telling me - that he had rational reasons to not believe - because I couldn't believe there were any. I've since come to see the fallacy in what I did and how rude and obnoxious I must have seemed. In fact, I made contact with him just a few weeks ago and apologized for my intrusion into his life. He didn't remember me, but he did appreciate the apology. He has since been the president of American Atheists.Ruthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17313118060838041133noreply@blogger.com